143 Takegawa cyl install.

[m in sc]

this is a few pics from installing the takegawa 143cc cylinder. I also updated the cam chain tensioner with a koso unit, and installed a pcx150 honda injector at same time. wasn't bad. about 4 hours.

prior to this, already installed a TB cam and an efie fuel management device, and de-catted stock pipe and made a new free-er flowing head-pipe. Pulling alternator rotor requires the correct puller which i already had. everything here can be purchased through hard racing, except the efie unit. Only reason i used that was an adjustable ecm isnt availabel fro the CT125's as of yet as they are different than the cubs, groms, and monkeys as of 10-2021.

stock chain tensioner:

hole with copper washer is oil galley bolt for tensioner. this needs to be primed back up upon reinstall for auto tensioner,

koso chain tensioner and idler installed:

stock cyl to left:

stock piston to left.

could serve bean dip out of that bowl.

and new piston in. rest is just stock bolt in stuff.

 

[chuckklr98]

Nice

 

[dmonkey]

How is it running? Do you think the EFIE mod is necessary on top of the larger injector to get it near the proper air fuel ratio?

 

[m in sc]

yes, i do. because of the higher compression, it will create more heat and a slightly richer afr will cool things down a bit. its a 4 wire mod, super easy and reversible. you only need to interrupt the single 02 sensor wire. then find a ground and switched 12v, thats it. Mines barely cranked up (sitting at 20mV) but on an aircooled motor, it def matters. if it was a liquid cooled cyl and head different story. Checked plug today when i got to work and home, its perfect color. runs really good, have about 30 miles on it since last night. . At that setting, it was telling the ecm to run it at 13.5 afr, I do have a wideband probe for other projects, and checked it when I 1st did the efie. remember, the voltage offset just modifies the signal the 02 sensor sends, which is what tells the ecm what afr to target. stock is 14.7, on MINE @ 20mV it is at 13.5. it sounds way, way harder than it actually is. its super easy stuff.

 

[Wfoproductions]

You are leading the way lol! After install of tb cam and yoshi exhuast I put on the EFIE. Hoping to tune it a little more this coming weekend. 143 or high comp piston is my next move. Keep up the cool mods!

 

[m in sc]

there was a hitch. the cyl was machined too tight, takegawa was made aware and i already got the replacement. This happend saturday, new setup arrived today from japan. however, before it smeared the skirt, it was running perfect. at about 100 miles in, started making a bit of noise, and lo and behold, the skirt stuck. This time, the bore mic is coming out. and yes, i can set the clearance myself but what a bummer. minor hitch. No other damage. should eb back up in a day or 2, busy week for me w other stuff.

i would expect this from yuminashi or some other shit brand. I'm surprised this happened, never had an issue with any 'Take stuff. either way, part of the game. (here come the naysayers.. lol).

 

[AZ7000']

Isn’t there something about you can’t have cheap reliable power? You can have any 2 of those 3 options but not all 3?
I may do something someday but the ‘75 just cracked 3000 miles stock, that is attractive too.
Keep us in the loop!

 

[m in sc]

who said it was cheap? my time has value. I ran the grom motor on a variety of big bores, 2 of them were from takegawa, 1 from koso and never an issue until i completely overpowered/over-stressed the rod at 12k rpm. . but like anything manufactured, issues come up. Tolerance needs to be .0018-.002" , i'll verify before install this time, and adjust as needed. It'll be fine.

I just broke 2k last week on my 67 kawi. And, yes, i have been thru the motor.

 

[m in sc]

checked the clearances on the new cyl and yup. too tight. under .0015, so opened it up to .0019~.0020 with my hone in the mill and then crosshatched it with the ball hone. also removed the coating on the skirt, we do this with high HP 2t motors regularly as well as it just wears off almost immediately.

should be able to get it together in the next few days but evenings are sort of booked next few nights.

 

[dmonkey]

How did the process for this go, did Hard Racing or Takegawa cover the replacement since it was a bad clearance with the matched piston I assume it was sold with, or were you SOL and bought the new cylinder out of pocket since you didn't catch it before assembling the top end?

 

[m in sc]

Bought it from webike. they are dealing w the return. yes, it was sold as a matched pair so not sol. but fair Q. I ordered a new piston/cyl set as i knew what the issue was, then submitted the claim.

 

[m in sc]

as a follow up, got it all back together Thursday, and it fired right up. Just to be safe, ran the efie to 270 for break in. might leave it there, but rode it a bit friday, sunday, and to work today, have about 65? miles on it so far. can cruise it at about 1/2 throttle in 4th at 50 pretty steady and not nearly as unforgiving as stock w the extra torque the bigger bore gives. I might eventually go back w the stock cam or the 1st gen grom one i still have. But, so far, so good.

 

[m in sc]

so, Takegawa says the kit was 'not specced to this model' and wont take responsibility for it being too tight on bore clearances. WeBike is hiding behind that BS claim. The $ doesnt bothe rme, but the principle of it does. So, since they wont stand behind their products, I'll not use either one of them again.

They didn't want the returned part to investigate. I offered to ship back to them. Yet, this still is on their website (see pic). this is directly from the manufacturer.

I completely understand there being tolerancing issues with mass produced parts, I've done QA in both the railroad and military development segments and have 2 engineering degrees and 30+ years experience building motors, with my 1st ASE certs earned at 18 yrs old (quite a few years before I went back to school & college to earn my ME degrees in my mid 20's.) So, im def not ignorant on what happened here. Like said above, after setting the clearances correctly on the 2nd cylinder i bought, its been just fine. I should have checked it the 1st time.

their claim is that the tw bikes are different than the jp built bikes. This has zero effect on how they clearanced the piston to bore. Unfortunately they will never see any more business from me. Buyer beware.

 

[m in sc]

as an update:
webike saw it my way after a week of silence, emailed me, agreed with my assessment, and issued a full refund of the 1st kit. I'm good with that.

 

[AZ7000']

I too like to tinker but think reliability is the purpose of this bike for our family. Knowing what you know would you do it again? Or just part of it?

 

[m in sc]

of course I would, it didn't go back stock.
I've built engines in lots of daily drivers that are dead nuts reliable. Bad parts happen. At least I'm not cutting a check to get it done. On the hot rod stuff, the more extreme other projects, its way riskier but that's def not this situation.

I'm not bragging, but I'm definitely way more mechanically experienced than most. It was a defective part plain and simple... it happens. MY part to blame in this was I didn't check the clearance. I shouldn't have to, as it was a matched set... but I still should. I was complacent this time and it bit me. But, webike literally said in their email 'we agree with you and are issuing a refund'. Coming out of a company out of japan, that's pretty significant. I'm going to guess they checked the stock they had out of that batch and found the same issue.

 

[ByteOfTheCherry]

of course I would, it didn't go back stock.
I've built engines in lots of daily drivers that are dead nuts reliable. Bad parts happen. At least I'm not cutting a check to get it done. On the hot rod stuff, the more extreme other projects, its way riskier but that's def not this situation.

I'm not bragging, but I'm definitely way more mechanically experienced than most. It was a defective part plain and simple... it happens. MY part to blame in this was I didn't check the clearance. I shouldn't have to, as it was a matched set... but I still should. I was complacent this time and it bit me. But, webike literally said in their email 'we agree with you and are issuing a refund'. Coming out of a company out of japan, that's pretty significant. I'm going to guess they checked the stock they had out of that batch and found the same issue.

I was just going to order the 143 cyl/cam/efi set from webike(they have two in stock)...do you think they might be part of your batch...should I wait a little longer...??...

 

[m in sc]

im not sure. i have the second one in but i honed it out to a correct spec and its been fine. keep in mind, top speed maybe increased 3-4 mph but it low end and midrange were greatly improved.

 

[ByteOfTheCherry]

im not sure. i have the second one in but i honed it out to a correct spec and its been fine. keep in mind, top speed maybe increased 3-4 mph but it low end and midrange were greatly improved.

Low/Mid is mainly what I'm looking for...however I'm also hoping a one tooth front sprocket change will give that little more speed...??...I have access to a very good machine shop so a perfect fit will be 'availiable' Where I live(in SW UK) its hilly(low stuff but up/down all the time)

 

[ByteOfTheCherry]

im not sure. i have the second one in but i honed it out to a correct spec and its been fine. keep in mind, top speed maybe increased 3-4 mph but it low end and midrange were greatly improved.

Thinking about it why did you not choose a 170/180 kit with the 'mild ' cam...no substitute for 'cubes'...???