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#2425 doing maintenance, probably like an idiot

Penerka

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Jul 26, 2022
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7
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Colorado
I'll be adding to this whenever something interesting or new is done on the bike, hopefully remembering to take photos as I go. For new and prospective owners, this will be a reference for what they'll probably have to do themselves. For me and for everyone else, it'll be because my dumb arse forgot what I did & how to do it, and this way I just have to search for things that I posted until it becomes muscle memory.

Odometer: ~250 mi
On order: Sprockets F&R (OEM), DID 428 VX chain, Shinko 244 3.0x2.

Auto clutch adjustment
Difficulty: Very easy.
Tools: Flathead screwdriver, 14mm box wrench. (Optional: toothbrush)
Time: 1 min
TL,DR: 14mm to get the locknut loose, all the way to the right (gentle), all the way to the left (gentle), 1/8 turn to the right, tighten locknut.

Normally you'd do this as part of the 600 mi check. Shifting feels a bit iffy, like dirty oil or an out of adjustment clutch. With rain coming in, this was the only one I could get done in time.


#2425Maintenance
Hello,
So I attempted to adjust my auto clutch and may have messed it up. When I push down on the shift lever, it is still engaged. In other words when shifting, pushing down on the shift lever is in effect pulling in the clutch and when released the next gear is engaged. In my case, pushing down on the lever does not disengage the gear. Its like I'm shifting without a clutch. Also, should the adjustment be done with the engine cold? How far should the screw turn to the right before feeling resistance? Bike has 200 miles; fresh oil and filter. Thanks,
 

Penerka

New member
Joined
Jul 26, 2022
Messages
7
Location
Colorado
Hello,
So I attempted to adjust my auto clutch and may have messed it up. When I push down on the shift lever, it is still engaged. In other words when shifting, pushing down on the shift lever is in effect pulling in the clutch and when released the next gear is engaged. In my case, pushing down on the lever does not disengage the gear. Its like I'm shifting without a clutch. Also, should the adjustment be done with the engine cold? How far should the screw turn to the right before feeling resistance? Bike has 200 miles; fresh oil and filter. Thanks,
 

Penerka

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Joined
Jul 26, 2022
Messages
7
Location
Colorado
Thanks, I started fresh after bike cooled down and made the adjustment per the service manual. Operating as designed.
 

SneakyDingo

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Joined
Aug 6, 2021
Messages
1,561
How far the screw should be turned? I dunno, don't remember, IIRC less than 2 full turns though. You'll know it when you feel it, a feeble old woman with substantial strength loss in her hand is about the amount of force exerted. Fingertips tight to the right, then left, then 1/8 turn to the right.

m in sc is probably doing it right, but it's worked for me when hot. I did the first one cold, and the rest have been riding for like... 20-30 minutes (so engine at full temperature), then pulling over in annoyance and adjusting it because mid-ride it was a pain in the ass and was causing shift issues. With either approach I've had success in improving shifting long term.
 

Penerka

New member
Joined
Jul 26, 2022
Messages
7
Location
Colorado
How far the screw should be turned? I dunno, don't remember, IIRC less than 2 full turns though. You'll know it when you feel it, a feeble old woman with substantial strength loss in her hand is about the amount of force exerted. Fingertips tight to the right, then left, then 1/8 turn to the right.

m in sc is probably doing it right, but it's worked for me when hot. I did the first one cold, and the rest have been riding for like... 20-30 minutes (so engine at full temperature), then pulling over in annoyance and adjusting it because mid-ride it was a pain in the ass and was causing shift issues. With either approach I've had success in improving shifting long term.
Thank you.
 

SneakyDingo

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Aug 6, 2021
Messages
1,561
Odometer: 10,100 mi

Maintenance updates:
Steering Head Bearings (I dunno what they're called) brought back within spec

I suspected my bearings were not under the right tension, because if it were a bicycle I'd feel the same sensations. Gonna copy-pasta this from the other thread because lazy.

My point for following up on this was that last night, the 29mm socket arrived from Amazon.
  • 6mm Hex key to undo the 4 bolts on the handlebar mount, torque spec 27 Nm (3-24 service manual, note tightening order), and the upper pinch bolts on the forks, torque spec 29 Nm. (3-22)
  • 17mm socket to undo the fork caps, torque spec 22 Nm. (3-23)
  • 29mm socket to undo the steering stem nut on the top, torque spec 88 Nm. (3-25)
  • Ref: Steering Head Top Nut torque spec is to be initially tightened to 27 Nm. (3-25)
Officially what you're supposed to do is take that tool @dmonkey linked to, remove the upper triple clamp, torque it to 22 Nm and then put everything back together again. Unofficially I took my hook wrench, lifted the clamp up 3/4 of the depth of the clamp, and very carefully tightened the steering stem headrace nut. I tightened it to what I thought was roughly the correct spec and checked for handlebar flop to either side.

My expectation was that the bearings should bind very, very slightly such that the wheel will not flop over immediately if you lift the front wheel off the ground by pressing the rear wheel down to the ground (sit on the rack), tilt the front wheel slightly to the side, and then bang the seat hard with your fist. This isn't a very scientific test but it's generally indicative of whether the bearings have been overtightened if you're used to what in spec looks like. Like a couple of good whacks, sure, but that first one shouldn't be enough, it should move slightly but not flop completely over to me. Before I started, having it slightly off to the side and doing the ol' seat whack while the wheel was in the air was enough to make it flop. I tightened it until I got to the point where I think it's within spec and called it good.

This morning I rode to work, trying to hit all the undulations that would normally unload the front to generate that wobble I was familiar with. No wobble. Then I hit a couple of manhole covers that were generating a clunk before. No clunk. Looks like the problem for me at least was the tolerance was out of spec.



One other thing that I should note is the ~9000 mi experience of the OPMID cluster. This morning I bent over to clean the cluster and noticed that there was a groove there I hadn't noticed before. If you have an OPMID and you're concerned about wear from the cables it might be worth tactically applying some protective effort here.

20230803_143709704_iOS.jpg
 

dmonkey

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Jul 4, 2021
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Is that cable rub with the OPMID in the standard location, or with the center relocation bracket? Thanks
 

SneakyDingo

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Aug 6, 2021
Messages
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Odometer: 11,134 mi
Maintenance updates: BBR Motorsports BBR Heavy-Duty Fork Springs 650-HXR-7005 spring install + OEM caps (from OEM springs + Chimera Caps)

This procedure partially follows the fork oil change procedure, minus pulling the forks off the bike, so there's no detailed manuscript here. Since I flipped the bar mounts as a taller rider, off come the bars, off come the caps, and using a magnetic pickup tool out come the springs. Slowly and with a towel over the end of the forks, of course, so I don't spill oil everywhere. I also added some more oil back in as I put the springs back in to compensate for the loss due to removing the springs.

What I don't have to say in detailed instructions, I do have to say in photos. One thing that I noticed no one has really done is popped the springs out and compared them side-by-side against the OEM gear so you know what the difference is, and that's really why I'm adding these photos here. First off, here's a generic side-by-side of what I'm talking about. Before anyone says, "the spring is backwards"[1] or there's parts missing there's a reason for that. There's two additional components that are in the forks; those parts are being reused, so the only parts that change are the springs and the caps.

20230922_004057640_iOS.jpg

It may look like I didn't quite line things up right, but the Chimera caps actually sit slightly shorter than the OEM caps. The important thing is that the service manual calls out lining up the BOTTOM of the flange for the caps as aligning with the top of the tubes and the fork top bridge, so that's what I did for the photo[1].

20230922_004044987_iOS.jpg

And when you do that, this is what the other end looks like:

20230922_004051677_iOS.jpg

So as you can see, the overall unsprung setup is a little longer with the chimera caps and OEM springs, but the difference is very minimal in overall length. Remember how this is effectively a motorized wheelbarrow? Such things shouldn't matter too much right?

Overall, I noticed the headlight sits a little higher, which makes sense since the spring is a stiffer spring. It is a single rate spring, so the compression feels different. Does it feel better? Well... I think if you're really loading the front up, you'd benefit from this over the stock setup, even with the preload inserts. Or if you're like... really heavy, this will probably help more, and if you're REALLY heavy you could probably do the preload trick as well. I think it's stiff enough that I'm going to question it if my weight changes a little, so the old springs have gone into a box for safekeeping, although they're only $11 to replace so I don't feel too upset if something happens to them.

[1] Why did I photograph it with the spring "upside down" relative to how it would be in the fork? So I could capture in the chimera cap and OEM dual rate spring in the same photo, so you knew which was paired with which. When I photographed it in the correct orientation I found it was a little harder to see that pairing. When you actually install the springs, the tighter OEM spring windings are closest to the wheel axle.
 

SneakyDingo

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Aug 6, 2021
Messages
1,561
Odometer: 12,461 mi

New year, I guess it's time to check in again.

Not much really. New tubes after I got a flat. The cause of the flat was a torn valve stem, which was caused by low tire pressure, which was caused by me not screwing on the tire pressure monitoring cap that I have properly. Painful lesson learned resulting in me changing a tire in the rain, in a parking lot. Future me would do well to next time get everything zip tied up at (nice, warm, dry and well supplied) home with a new tire, bring the zip tied tire down, change everything over really fast and be on my way that way. It took me 2-3x longer because I was doing a roadside repair in the rain, and the tire lube is water soluble.

Aside from that, literally just oil changes and nothing else.

Next major services are brake fluid change and another oil change.
Next minor services are to grease up the kickstand and center stand so they spring back into place easily.
 

RideMyMonkey

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Joined
Jan 26, 2024
Messages
10
Location
Arizona
How far the screw should be turned? I dunno, don't remember, IIRC less than 2 full turns though. You'll know it when you feel it, a feeble old woman with substantial strength loss in her hand is about the amount of force exerted. Fingertips tight to the right, then left, then 1/8 turn to the right.

m in sc is probably doing it right, but it's worked for me when hot. I did the first one cold, and the rest have been riding for like... 20-30 minutes (so engine at full temperature), then pulling over in annoyance and adjusting it because mid-ride it was a pain in the ass and was causing shift issues. With either approach I've had success in improving shifting long term.
In the Trail's Service Manual they have an abbreviated Fastener Torque Value Spec. Section 1-12;

In the Honda Service Manual they have an extensive section on all Honda Factory used Fasteners, including Special Fasteners that require additional step to torque properly.

I hope this helps
 

SneakyDingo

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Joined
Aug 6, 2021
Messages
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In the Trail's Service Manual they have an abbreviated Fastener Torque Value Spec. Section 1-12;

In the Honda Service Manual they have an extensive section on all Honda Factory used Fasteners, including Special Fasteners that require additional step to torque properly.

I have both of those manuals, as well as digital copies of all of them, and honestly I've never been able to find the adjustment procedure described in either of the manuals.

- There's a mention in the trail's service manual to let the bike cool before servicing it, however the reason it's there is to stop you from burning yourself, so if you don't mind dealing with heat it's not that important.
- There's the maintenance inspection interval for the Clutch system, however it says "inspect" and it should be done by an authorized dealer, or refer to the Honda Trail125A bigger service manual.
- In the bigger Trail 125A service manual, on page 1-13 it has the clutch adjusting screw lock nut torque value, but not the screw itself.
- Under the Maintenance Schedule on 1-34, it points to page references for various service operations. Ironically the clutch system is still marked here as a "take it to the dealer" situation with no page reference.
- On page 2-23 it points to the closest thing to a reference that I've ever seen, which is the adjustment bolt locking nut (12 Nm, labeled #1 in the picture below) and bolt (labeled #2). But the procedure itself isn't described.

1706564138011.png

I also have the big, fat uber manual that you can buy, the Honda Common Service manual. Maybe it's in there somewhere, or some dealer only documentation, but that manual is pretty fat and I haven't had time to go through all of it. But at least from the owner's manual and the CT125A specific service manual, there's no references I have seen for the adjustment procedure.
 
Last edited:

dmonkey

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I think @RideMyMonkey was just not sure of the screw being mentioned. There is no torque spec for it because it's an adjustment screw. The lock nut that holds it in place has a torque spec as @SneakyDingo pointed out.

There's a generic procedure for the clutch adjustment in the Common Service Manual with a photo of an older single clutch system engine while the CT125 has separate centrifugal and shifter clutches.

https://hondatrail125.com/index.php?attachments/auto-clutch-adj-jpg.2121/


The 2019 Super Cub C125 service manual does have the clutch adjustment procedure documented on page 3-17. It's not in the 2021 Trail 125 CT125 service manual though.

1706571669028.png
 

SneakyDingo

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Aug 6, 2021
Messages
1,561
Odometer: 13,604 mi

Bike feels like several items are all going to hit at the same time and are worth doing the next time it's sunny, dry and/or I have the opportunity to. I'm currently working on grouping them together to more effectively tackle them.

Engine:
  • Valve check / adjust
  • Replaced the spark plug - did this last night, realized later should have waited and/or done the valve check at the same time, but I was in a hurry. Felt an immediate improvement in the engine behavior.
  • Oil change
    • I do my oil changes early, every 2k or so.
    • I strongly, STRONGLY suspect that the Las Cruces Honda dealership never cleaned out the spinner when I asked them to do the 8k service but because I run generally pretty clean oil I am not noticing anything that weird. I'm tempted to do this a little early assuming I can get some good enough weather, but I have also set aside some time in May/June to do it for real.

Drivetrain
  • Chain replacement - feels like it's stretched to the point I should replace it. I think I let it go long enough that I can't get away without doing the next two items as well.
  • Countersprocket replacement
  • Rear sprocket replacement
  • I think that I may have let my chain adjustment get away from me at one point and that there's wear on the chain slider because of it (52170-K0G-900).

Wheels and brakes
  • Tires and tubes - current tires are nearing the point they should be replaced, both front and rear.
  • Brake pad inspection/replacement
  • Brake fluid replacement
Suspension/Generic:
  • I usually do this either annually or twice annually, but I go through and coat an anti-seize on various bolts. Under the rear suspension is one of them because it was in a worse-than-expected state when I looked at it before
  • Depending on the next 2-3 weeks, swapping back to the original suspension springs and chimera bolts. I lost enough weight that it's noticeable.
 
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