Should you buy it? Honda Extended Warranty Specifics - deep dive, contract wordage, and whether you should get it or not. Reason #7 will surprise you!

SneakyDingo · Jun 20, 2022

This post will not be maintained, and I request this be moved and pinned to the most appropriate forum.
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I've mentioned this a few times. I bought the extended warranty from Honda Care when I purchased my motorcycle because it was cheap'ish and had a feature that I felt was very applicable to me. Unfortunately, it seems like no one actually knows what the coverage is like, etc. So I included partial contract details, as well as some thoughts at the end. Is this a long ass post? You bet your baby stealing britches it is. So long I have to break it up into several posts.

In the spirit of "I don't wanna read all of this' the very, very, very short version:

The focus of this particular area of content is on the idea that there are three main things to be concerned about on the bike, specific to not being at home or at a dealership:

Bike won't start.
Bike has no gas.
Bike has a flat tire.

Regarding HondaCare, I learned something about it. HondaCare is now provided through Brickell Financial Services Motor Club,Inc. doing business as Road America Motor Club, also known as Road America. If you go to their website, Road America has this entry on it:

Road America is now an Agero owned brand.

Don’t worry, many of the services you know and love are still here. Many of the Roadside Assistance programs remain unchanged -- the toll-free phone numbers used to access the program have not changed, nor the membership or policy number used to access benefits.

I am negatively inclined to recommend the extended warranty because suing a company like this is a f**king nightmare to go through all the hoops for legal entities, and suing companies like this is often how you get them to do the right thing when they don't do the right thing. Also they're basically an insurance company in the guts of it all, so they basically live for litigation and denying claims.

Looking closely at Agero/Aegis:

The Agero website itself makes it very difficult to locate who the authorized dealers are (this is important).
BBB does not approve of Aegis (Aegis being listed inside the contract itself). There are 5 customer complaints, 1 resolved, which required the dealership to step in.
Reverse searching the phone number for service results in hits for Aegis Powersports. Yelp gives them a 2 star rating. However, I think the true rating is a 1 star rating. Yelp has been in hot water before for their review system, so it's important to consider beyond the first page reviews. If you look at the non-first page listings, they're all 1 star.

Next thing to review is the contract itself.

Exact wordage of the contract is below, pulled directly from the contract, focusing specifically on the sections pertinent to getting shit fixed while out and about and getting shit towed below. I didn't include stuff relevant to the parts warranty. (text obtained through OCR, may contain minor errors)

Roadside Assistance
Emergency Road Service is provided through Nation Motor Club, LLC. with administrative offices at 800 Yamato Road, Suite 100, Boca Raton, FL 33431. For assistance call toll-free 866-330-0760. When calling for roadside assistance, You will be required to give the dispatch representative the Producer Code: 36583 and Plan Letter(s): "U" and Your Agreement number on the top right corner of the Agreement.

• For Alaska, Alabama, Utah, and Virginia members, services are provided by Nation Safe Drivers Services, Inc.
• For California members, services are provided by Nation Motor Club, LLC., California Motor Club Permit Number 5157-3,

Emergency Road Service is available when Your Unit is disabled as long as this Agreement is in effect. No Deductible applies to the following. Note: One paid benefit per 72-hours.

Limitations: This is a dispatch service. In the event you have contracted for any covered services on your own, you may send your receipted expenses for reimbursement consideration to Nation Safe Drivers, 800 Yamato Rd. STE 100, Boca Raton, FL 33431. Maximum reimbursement for services not obtained through our toll-free number is strictly limited to $50.00. Service is not available for units that are not within 15 feet of a regularly maintained roadway.

EMERGENCY ROAD SERVICE consists of the following:

Flat Tire Towing Service: In the event of a flat tire on the Unit, we will arrange to have the Unit transported up to 25 miles at no out of pocket expense to you.
Battery Service: In the event the Unit will not start due to a weak or "run down" battery we will arrange for a service provider to boost or jump-start the Unit with a booster battery.
Delivery Service: We will arrange for the delivery of emergency supplies of gasoline, oil or water and other accessories and supplies as may be required and available. You are responsible for the cost of supplies delivered.
Towing Service: In the event the Unit is disabled, we will arrange to have the Unit transported to a destination of Your choice up to 25 miles at no out of pocket expense to you.

YOUR ROADSIDE ASSISTANCE MEMBER ID NUMBER IS THE SAME AS YOUR CONTRACT NUMBER. EMERGENCY ROAD SERVICE WILL BE ADMINISTERED BY NATION MOTOR CLUB, LLC, DBA NATION SAFE DRIVERS 800 YAMATO ROAD, SUITE 100, BOCA RATON, FLORIDA 33431

What to do in the event of a failure:
During Business Hours; Contact Provider at (800) 572-5099 for repair shop instructions prior to repair. A repair facility will be approved if they are an Aegis selling dealer in good standing with Aegis or a franchise of the manufacturer. The qualified repair facility will then contact Provider for repair authorization. Under no circumstances may a repair be commenced or a repair completed and the vehicle released under the contract without prior Aegis authorization.
When Provider is Closed: Covered emergency repairs of $200 or less may be made by the contract holder to make the vehicle operable. All repairs must be substantiated with proof of receipt or invoice. Contract holder must return the vehicle to the qualified repair facility to obtain prior authorization from Provider for any covered emergency exceeding $200 (see "During Business Hours" above).
Road Hazard Option: Photograph damage showing entire bike with the damaged tire or wheel, the bike with the VIN and also photograph the damage in an up-close detailed photograph(s). If the tire is damaged, please show the damage and tread depth. Provider may request photographs or other documents at any time during the claim process to substantiate the claim.

SneakyDingo · Jun 20, 2022

My day job until I quit my previous job was in quality assurance, where I basically represent hackers, malicious users, and the like. I am the guy that reads the entirety of the TSA website and knows there are like 6 items you can leave in your carry on to prevent it being checked in, one of them being live coral. I got my first American job... uh... "testing" vending machines.

(my job description really was close to stuff like this. I am probably the guy that makes you think "I really want to know the story for why they included that in the contract.")

I look at this and the contract makes me shudder if you, the private owner, had to deal with the company. This is very clearly in the "hire someone to do this shit for you", in the same way I hire a lawyer every time I've been hit by a car and it's been worth it. I'm almost at the point where I get a freebie on my punch card. For that reason, if your dealership is a Honda Powersports franchise, I would say that this has a sliver of hope: they do the heavy lifting, you just get the end result. You literally pay someone to insulate you from the stupid. If your dealership is an Aegis/Agero dealer, and in the unlikely event you are actually dealing with shit that is covered, you might save some bucks.

That being said, this is a cheap man's bike. Pretty much everything on the bike is cheap. For that reason, I'm focusing purely on the "what if" you're out on the road and shit happens, because if it's sitting at home in the garage, chances are you're not stuck to just this bike and can take your time fixing it using parts shipped overnight from Japan. If you didn't get the extended coverage, you can pay $299 in expedited shipping and say "Arigato gozaimasu Webike to kitaco"

First off, if you modify the bike in certain ways, they will take that angle to deny your claim. There are already comments on the BBB reporting site about them denying claims for that. A recent failure where the OPMID cluster install is suspected to have allowed a plug to jiggle loose would mean you would be denied coverage for anything related to that. Tires that are too bald and got a flat tire would be denied coverage. If the oil ever runs low, you can be denied coverage. Expect the very first thing to come back being denied coverage, and if you complain personally, they'll show you the link to deactivate your account with them and think nothing more of it.

Secondly, their towing is a dispatch service. Which means you're at the mercy of dispatch, which may mean they get your bike towed to where you need it on Tuesday. Which is fine if it's a Tuesday, but problematic if it's a Thursday.

Thirdly, their contract reads like Aetna Healthcare was employed to draft up the contract. You have to get preauthorization for certain kinds of work. There's a lot of things that aren't covered.

In short, I would consider what I'm reading to generally be unscrupulous and deceptive business practices for most users. Legal? Yes. But hardly the "we've got you covered**" (terms and conditions apply) that we would expect from a quality institution like Honda.

So here we are at the end of this post. Ask yourself: How willing I am to hire a lawyer? Because frankly, that's what it is coming down to. You don't want to deal directly with Agero, Aegis, or whoever is actually running the extended warranty program.

SneakyDingo · Jun 20, 2022

What should you get instead of the HondaCare services? I got two answers so far.

AAA RV towing is the bees knees. I've had this advice for like 15 years now and apparently nothing has changed.
From my local dealership they advised getting AMA Roadside assistance, in addition to AAA RV insurance.

dmonkey · Jun 20, 2022

What a nightmare. Thanks for digging into this, it certainly helped me feel more confident in my decision of not extending my Honda Care. It is incredibly uncomfortable how hard sales people try to push this stuff on you at dealerships.

SneakyDingo said:
Service is not available for units that are not within 15 feet of a regularly maintained roadway.

Ooof. This is a big one out by me in CO, that's a lot of the roads I end up riding the Honda Trail on. Luckily there is a non-profit run by volunteers, Colorado 4x4 Rescue and Recovery, who's hobby it is to recover 4x4s, cars, motorcycles, snowmobiles, you name it - and get them back to roadways for tow service.

Another thing to be cautious of, the more layers involved in roadside assistance, the more likely you are to have dispatch send out a tow vehicle that is not equipped to recover a motorcycle. My experience with AAA is that they get the driver from the local roadside service provider to call you, and that's a good time to make sure they know it's a motorcycle they'll be working with so they arrive with the right vehicle. Another nice thing about AAA is that you really don't need to pay for it until you need it. You can sign up on the side of the road over the phone.

It's nice to go to local events and make friends with other riders. The number of times someone has told me they have a truck and here's their number if I ever need help is really heart warming. There are plenty of folks who are nice and helpful, just like users on this forum, who will go out of their way to lend a hand. It's always good to reward them with drinks, food, gas money, etc. if they help you out considering how much cheaper those are than a tow!

m in sc · Jun 21, 2022

years ago. i mean years ago when i bought my 99 sv650, I bough the extended warranty from them though 'funancing' when that was still around. Unlimited 4 year warranty after the initial 1 year thru suzuki, on the SV. it wasnt bad, was like an extra few hundred bucks covered anything that wasnt a wear item. Was absolutely legit , at least that one was. near the end of the 5 years, I used ot 2x. 1 was the tach overlay started to peel off, and they covered a brand new gauge. 2nd time was the fuel tank started to leak at the back seam, and yup, they replaced it. that was w 3 mos left to go on the warranty. Choose carefully on extended warranties, and make sure they are through the manufacturer only. On the trail would i get one? oh hell no. But not all are bad, (most are) just do your research. .02

SneakyDingo · Jun 21, 2022

m in sc said:
But not all are bad, (most are) just do your research. .02

I agree, it is worth doing due diligence on the warranty. In this case, it would have been impossible to do such diligence prior to signing the paperwork in a reasonable fashion - it took me some time in front of a desktop on a high speed internet connection to untangle what was going on with the contract I had signed, and would have been difficult to do on my phone. The Honda dealership was definitely not making it easy to determine this on the spot.

m in sc · Jun 22, 2022

make em wait. I did, hell.. in 1999... mine was on paper.

If they dont have time to let their customer read a contract, f-em.

dmonkey · Jun 22, 2022

That's the thing, they use the sales tactic of offering a discount only then, and not later. It creates a sense of urgency and pressures people into buying it without reading the fine print. It's a common psychological manipulation, lots of shady websites do something similar saying "in X number of people's carts", "X available", "X% off for 20 minutes". Usually if that type of thing happens I just back away entirely, I don't want to be pressured into something like that.

m in sc · Jun 22, 2022

YUP. I dont play that game, walked away from Z900 rs sale because they were being douchebags in a similar fashion back in 2018. And I told them so when me and my 2 other middle aged friends with bad spending habits and lots of motorcycles walked out of there. (team charlotte in NC, FWIW) . Lost an FJR1300 sale at the same time.

SLO · Jun 22, 2022

SneakyDingo said:
What should you get instead of the HondaCare services? I got two answers so far.

AAA RV towing is the bees knees. I've had this advice for like 15 years now and apparently nothing has changed.

From my local dealership they advised getting AMA Roadside assistance, in addition to AAA RV insurance.

I forgot I got AAA. Can I call them if I get a flat? Or a ride/tow out of the boonies ? That would be good for solo rides like the ones I take ,except probably would have an issue with cell service. I wonder if you could use a drone to relay a phone call? That would solve a big issue not due to distance ,but line of site from cell rower.

SneakyDingo · Jun 22, 2022

Make em wait

A simplified way to look at it is if it had cost me $50 to buy, and $100 of my time to research, then just paying the $50 is cheaper. I assessed that at the time, my time was valuable enough that paying the small fee associated with it was a reasonable investment (I still feel this way). If I used it successfully just once, it would save me money.

When it comes to the forum, what costs me $100 of my time to research has different calculations; there is a N person break even point. In this case, it's N=3 - if 3 people don't buy it, then the overall effect is a net positive. It would also take them substantially less because all the information is in one place.

dmonkey · Jun 22, 2022

SLO said:
I forgot I got AAA. Can I call them if I get a flat? Or a ride/tow out of the boonies ? That would be good for solo rides like the ones I take ,except probably would have an issue with cell service. I wonder if you could use a drone to relay a phone call? That would solve a big issue not due to distance ,but line of site from cell rower.

You'd have to check your AAA plan's coverage, not all of them cover motorcycles, but some do.

SLO · Jun 22, 2022

dmonkey said:
You'd have to check your AAA plan's coverage, not all of them cover motorcycles, but some do.

I will call them , thanks.

m in sc · Jun 22, 2022

yeah trying to calculate my 'value of time' for my hobby is a complete waste of my time TBH. lol. Never a bad idea to read a contract you are putting your name onto, on anything to that matter. .02 Anything i do outside my offices is personal and doesn't really have a dollar amount associated w it. Otherwise.. that makes life 'work' and f-that.

STUBBORN · Jun 22, 2022

SneakyDingo said:
What should you get instead of the HondaCare services? I got two answers so far.

AAA RV towing is the bees knees. I've had this advice for like 15 years now and apparently nothing has changed.

From my local dealership they advised getting AMA Roadside assistance, in addition to AAA RV insurance.

Stubborn heah,
My NH Honda ProSport dealer (NAULTS) has an "addendum". Non negotiable. Every motorcycle sold must pay for this addendum = Added Theft coverage and "complimentary" Battery Plan. I get $4.00 off on Motorcycle Insurance.
The 3 - 5 year Addendum extension is more expensive than the $0 deductible standard Motorcycle insurance.
Is it worth extending this addendum?

dmonkey · Jun 22, 2022

So it's theft coverage and a battery plan? How much does it cost?
The theft protection is likely a few stickers they slap on the bike, you'd really need to read the fine print on how it works if your bike is actually stolen and what needs to be done to prove it for payout.
The simple answer would be that if your bike isn't stolen and you don't have battery issues, it's just some peace of mind and wouldn't yield a return on investment.

Kev250R · Jun 23, 2022

SLO said:
I forgot I got AAA. Can I call them if I get a flat? Or a ride/tow out of the boonies ? That would be good for solo rides like the ones I take ,except probably would have an issue with cell service. I wonder if you could use a drone to relay a phone call? That would solve a big issue not due to distance ,but line of site from cell rower.

I'm an avid off-roader (4wd Truck, ATV's, Dual-sport MC's and two VW-Based Dune Buggies). In my experience AAA won't send a truck down a dirt road (even if it's a named or marked County Road). I found that out the hard way one time when I locked my keys in my truck at a Staging Area five miles down a graded dirt road and they wouldn't send anyone, so when I leave the dirt I figure my AAA Membership is pretty much useless (I have used it for on-road help or tow's many times, though never with a MC).

However there are off-road recovery groups (such as Off-Road Recovery Portal) where you send them a message and they gather a group of volunteers who will come and get you out for free, or just the cost of expenses (be ready to buy a lot of Pizza!) I belong to one of these groups (I live 20 minutes from a popular off-roading area here in So.Cal.) however I've yet to go on a recovery.

Last option, if you break-down or get hopelessly stuck is to call an off-road recovery company (such as Matt's Off-Road Recovery on YouTube if you happen to be near South-Western Utah). I had to do that last Fall when I was way out in the Dixie National Forest outside of Bryce Canyon, Utah and one of my VW-based 'Buggies snapped a Spindle, lost a front wheel 20 miles from town and needed to be towed-back to where I was staying. In my case I called a local tow operator who had a 4x4 Tow Truck and was able to get to where I was broken-down and tow me out. It took close to eight hours and cost $1,000 so it's not a cheap option but it's a good last resort if you ever need it.

In my experience riding Dual-Sport MC's off-road all over the Southwest for the past 12 years or so, only one time has anyone I've ridden with has had a breakdown which left his bike (a WR250R with a bad Stator) disabled in the woods. In that case I was able to ride back to my friend's truck and get it (almost) out to where his bike had broken-down and get it home. So if you're a solo rider who doesn't take unnecessary risks (plus you're riding a Honda!) chances are good you'll never need to worry about being stuck in the woods.

SLO · Jun 24, 2022

Kev250R said:
I'm an avid off-roader (4wd Truck, ATV's, Dual-sport MC's and two VW-Based Dune Buggies). In my experience AAA won't send a truck down a dirt road (even if it's a named or marked County Road). I found that out the hard way one time when I locked my keys in my truck at a Staging Area five miles down a graded dirt road and they wouldn't send anyone, so when I leave the dirt I figure my AAA Membership is pretty much useless (I have used it for on-road help or tow's many times, though never with a MC).

However there are off-road recovery groups (such as Off-Road Recovery Portal) where you send them a message and they gather a group of volunteers who will come and get you out for free, or just the cost of expenses (be ready to buy a lot of Pizza!) I belong to one of these groups (I live 20 minutes from a popular off-roading area here in So.Cal.) however I've yet to go on a recovery.

Last option, if you break-down or get hopelessly stuck is to call an off-road recovery company (such as Matt's Off-Road Recovery on YouTube if you happen to be near South-Western Utah). I had to do that last Fall when I was way out in the Dixie National Forest outside of Bryce Canyon, Utah and one of my VW-based 'Buggies snapped a Spindle, lost a front wheel 20 miles from town and needed to be towed-back to where I was staying. In my case I called a local tow operator who had a 4x4 Tow Truck and was able to get to where I was broken-down and tow me out. It took close to eight hours and cost $1,000 so it's not a cheap option but it's a good last resort if you ever need it.

In my experience riding Dual-Sport MC's off-road all over the Southwest for the past 12 years or so, only one time has anyone I've ridden with has had a breakdown which left his bike (a WR250R with a bad Stator) disabled in the woods. In that case I was able to ride back to my friend's truck and get it (almost) out to where his bike had broken-down and get it home. So if you're a solo rider who doesn't take unnecessary risks (plus you're riding a Honda!) chances are good you'll never need to worry about being stuck in the woods.

What would be determined to be an unnecessary risk? Bears, or sketchy humans in remote areas. Deer running out in front ,or on top of you. I could probably make it home on hoof in a day or so, but I am going to keep a LIFESTRAW on me. Lack of water can kill you in minutes,,or a few hours if you want to be optimistic. It will be lightning that got SLO, he should have ZIGGED when he ZAGGED ! I guess it ain't about speed, but guessing right. I don't understand why they don't call me LUCKY instead of SLO?

Kev250R · Jun 24, 2022

SLO said:
What would be determined to be an unnecessary risk? Bears, or sketchy humans in remote areas. Deer running out in front ,or on top of you. I could probably make it home on hoof in a day or so, but I am going to keep a LIFESTRAW on me. Lack of water can kill you in minutes,,or a few hours if you want to be optimistic. It will be lightning that got SLO, he should have ZIGGED when he ZAGGED ! I guess it ain't about speed, but guessing right. I don't understand why they don't call me LUCKY instead of SLO?

For the group I ride with an unnecessary risk would be riding recklessly. We're not the ones riding wheelies down the trail with blindfolds on, or having drinks at our favorite lunch stop. We do ride some of the harder trails in the Mojave and Forest surrounding Big Bear (our average desert ride is 80-100 in a day, mountain rides are 50-70 typically) but we do it at a relaxed pace.

I don't carry a Lifestraw (water can be scarce in the areas where I ride) but I do carry lot of water with me; my friends do too (with water, tools, supplies, etc my riding bag is close to 50 LBS!). Two of us carry emergency locating beacons (I have a SPOT device, someone else in our group has a competing model). We all have First Aid kits, I carry a small Fire Extinguisher, most of us are armed and we are pretty good at figuring-out what to do in unexpected situations. We've seen bears in the forest, dealt with Meth Heads in rural camping areas and remote camps out in the desert. I dislike riding in the rain so I've yet to ride where Lightning has been a hazard, however I have been caught in the rain a few times. Generally our biggest hazard when that happens is that the rest of the group has to put-up with me complaining about having to ride in the rain LOL!

That's not to say that we don't have mishaps, we do. A year ago I took a really bad spill on my TW on a forest road thought I broke my left wrist. As I mentioned another guy had an unexpected break-down on what at the time was a nearly-new bike. My off-road car snapped a Spindle and left a friend and I stranded in the forest. We've had other things happen too, but for me it's all about how you prepare and react to them which (generally) makes the difference between telling a tragic story when you get back home or an amusing one.

SneakyDingo · Jun 24, 2022

SLO said:
I am going to keep a LIFESTRAW on me.

Not gonna lie, as an Aussie who has almost perished in the desert a few times, I've had (and used) a Lifestraw, as well as the Sawyer Squeeze kits. They're pretty rough pieces of kit to rely on, especially in a group setting, and ESPECIALLY the LifeStraw. I would use the Sawyer kit 10 out of 10 times over a Lifestraw, and from memory it packs down smaller too. The main complaint I have about the Sawyer kits is they're slow; the pump I carry does 1L of water a minute at the expense of being slightly bigger (better for group settings or when water resupply is very far between, but time is a factor). I also like gravity fed systems. But easiest of all is to pack the water with me, which can be heavy, but is usually worth it.

Somewhere on this forum (tools megathread IIRC) someone mentioned carrying a 4 way silcock with them, aka keys to the city, for unlocking semi permanent water supplies as needed. However in my home state, many of the water sources those are connected to are also not generally recommended or suited for drinking without distillation/treatment due to the presence of dissolved salts and minerals.

SPOT devices are definitely worth their weight in gold too, as are first aid kits and general recovery equipment. Mostly though, using your noggin and some basic equipment will get you through most situations (as Ed March frequently proves), but to me... the biggest threat to me is other people. Animals and wildlife will probably leave me alone if I'm not stupid... but people won't.

If I had to take a single, solitary piece of gear to get me out of sh*t beyond glorified water bottles... SPOT device. Especially the ones that have a more flexible interface (I think it uses an app).

Should you buy it? Honda Extended Warranty Specifics - deep dive, contract wordage, and whether you should get it or not. Reason #7 will surprise you!

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