What parts can swap?

[Dallasdude]

Wanted to know what parts are swappable. For started I would like to ride more street so does the Honda cub rear sprocket swap on the trail? Also I know top end is same as a Grom but the semi auto trans is different. Down the line if I find a good Grom engine the 4 speed older type can it be used and will the semi auto trail 125 transmission swap over to a 4 speed Grom motor? Thanks in advance

 

[dmonkey]

JT Sprockets sell proper 428 sprockets in various sizes that fit the Honda Trail so I wouldn't bother trying to mix match a 420 sprocket from the Super Cub. The JTR269 fits the rear, you just may want to switch to lock nuts with a smaller head size so they sit flush.

Sprockets

i had a 13/45 on mine and it was too low, put the 14 back on and way better now, except for that dam abs light flashing A little circle of electrical tape over the light fixes that!

hondatrail125.com

The Honda Trail doesn't run out of RPM at the top of 4th so you're not likely to gain top speed by regearing alone. The motor needs to make more power to make use of the gearing.

Wayne @ The Speed Shop has swapped the semi-auto and manual transmission setups along with the crankshaft between the Grom and Trail:

The Speed Shop

The Speed Shop

www.thespeedshopmini.com

A member on this forum has either an older Grom or first generation (2021-2022 JA55) Trail 125 engine swapped into her (JA65) 2023 Trail (built by Wayne):

🩷 Fancy 🩷

Hey everyone! I thought I would make my own thread to document/highlight my CT125 build progress. I purchased my 2023 CT at the end of May and have enjoyed this minimoto so much. The only regret I had post purchase was the hill climb power and even top speed even though I fully realize that, out...

hondatrail125.com

In Vietnam there's a builder who put all kinds of Honda 110/125 engines into Trail 125s built around OEM parts since the Trail 125 isn't sold there but the parts can be ordered:

CT125 Conversion in Vietnam - Need Your Expertise!

Hey everyone, Im after some advice on converting a Honda scooter to a CT125. So, I'm currently living it up in Vietnam, and I've got my eye on a Honda CT125. The trouble is, they are not sold here by Honda. I could import a brand new one from Thailand, but that's gonna cost me $10,000ish USD...

hondatrail125.com

And there are some other options if you want to do a manual clutch conversion:

Manual Clutch Conversion?

Just out of curiosity, has anyone done this as of yet? I still have my original grom motor (with a broken rod but still).. has anyone done this yet? I looked online but found not much.

hondatrail125.com

@m in sc currently has a regular manual hand clutch setup on his Honda Trail 125, documented in that thread. There are also conversions to just do the shifter clutch to a hand clutch and retain the centrifugal clutch so you don't have to pull the clutch in at a stop.

IMO what's more important than top speed is what speed you can pull on a mild incline, that's where the Honda Trail really struggles. There are some big bore kit builds documented on this forum where folks have improved the practical use speed of the bike so it can haul up inclines better as well as gaining some top speed on flat ground.

I'd recommend managing your expectations. If you want a faster bike you might have more fun just buying a faster bike and riding that instead of or in addition to the Trail 125. There have been quite a few people who bought the Trail 125 and sold it with low miles for various reasons, power and speed are among those reasons. It's not practical or fun for everyone and that's fine, there are plenty of other motorcycles out there.

 

[m in sc]

you can dump a grom motor in the trail. the biggest thing to work around is the shitty ecm the trail has, period. there lots of work arounds but nowhere near as many as the grom world.

lots of certain hard parts swap over, some dont but its hit and miss.. but this is also for the 1st gen trails (ja55). the new version is out now w a different motor so? probably even less options. .02

 

[Dallasdude]

Thanks for the info and replies. I watched Wayne’s vid and he mentions about the bottom end was from a trail to make a semi auto Grom. I was thinking if the whole Grom engine bottom in included could be used in the trail without a clutch and just swap on the 4 speed stuff on the Grom bottom end. Main reason I’m asking is I do deliveries and 50-60k miles comes up quick. About 1.5-2years. So yeah thinking long term and cheap replacement engines. Would be interesting to know if any lifans could be made to fit semi auto style. I used to do it on scooters but they are to stiff and 8 hours a day takes a toll on your back on scooters. Also clutching 8 hours a day takes a toll on your hands. So the trail seems like the solution to riding 8 hours a day without destroying back and hands. After all they are called postie bikes in aus where mail carriers ride them 8 hours a day delivering mail. I didn’t think about the ecu issue. I know it might be awhile before some used trail 125 engines start showing up on eBay so looking at other options. After 50-60k miles I don’t want to rebuild the top end because the bottom end and gears might go soon after so looking at the entire engine swap process. Thanks again for all the above info.

 

[Dallasdude]

I'd recommend managing your expectations. If you want a faster bike you might have more fun just buying a faster bike and riding that instead of or in addition to the Trail 125. There have been quite a few people who bought the Trail 125 and sold it with low miles for various reasons, power and speed are among those reasons. It's not practical or fun for everyone and that's fine, there are plenty of other motorcycles out there.

My reasoning for wanting to change or swap on cub gears was to shift less or hold gears longer, not for top speed. I know the trail is geared a bit more for climbing then the cub I believe by 2 teeth. I plan on using it for city delivery and the roads here are so jacked up you need a trail or motocross bike to handle city streets here so that’s the reason not to get a cub. As for the faster bike got a mt-07 and ninja 250 also a custom 150 scooter that hits 70mph. All are set up for food deliver. Food delivery on the mt7 sucks. Food delivery on the ninja 250 kind of sucks but not terrible also not desirable. Food delivery on the 150 scooter is almost nice if it wasn’t so stiff and a back breaker. I’ve also tried 3 other scooters and suspension mods and come to realize all scooters are just stiff and my ninja 250 is always more comfortable on my back then all my past scooters but not as light and nimble enough for delivery. Then there is the trail. Possible the holy grail for delivery with its 17” wheels and suspension and weight. Definitely the right tool I think for the job. Now if only I could get the Michelin pilot moto gp tires in USA. People run them in Taiwan on the trail 125. Best sticking tire in trail size hands down. Used to have a set on a 14” Suzuki scooter. Way better that the Michelin pilot street 2 tires that I’m running on my current scooter. In fact those tires were kind of a let down. I guess I’ll have to bring back some from Taiwan next time I go but customs has some weird thing about tires. Maybe they don’t allow used tires because bugs get in them or maybe they don’t allow new or used. All I know is every time I buy a wheel from Europe for a project it gets sent back at customs if a tire is on it.

 

[dmonkey]

Long term and cheap replacement, the Super Cub 125 is a more common motorcycle so it will have that advantage over the Honda Trail. The Honda Trail 125 is better on rough roads, but they're not worlds apart. None of the modern bikes available in the USA are really Postie bikes. The Trail 125 has that heritage (and I even call mine a Postie bike), but it's not actually used by Aus Post. The CT110 was a completely different bike, and when Honda stopped making that model Aus Post replaced it with the Super Cub (NBC110) which is the current 2-wheeled Postie motorbike.

My Trail 125 has been used for deliveries and grocery hauls and it's a very approachable, fun, reliable, and economical bike for that. I think it's a great choice as long as you don't need to regularly ride at high speeds. IMO it's a good idea to give things a fair trial in stock form before making changes.

I've had the same issue with tires being rejected at customs. The problem seems to be with tires that aren't DOT approved, which is a self approval the manufacturer does.

 

[m in sc]

look at an XR150L. cheaper and way better suspension. they come with a rack but it can be enlarged, but has a full clutch, so no semi auto. but way, way more comfortable than the trail by a long shot. Just a thought. Yes, i own one so speak from direct experience.

 

[Dallasdude]

look at an XR150L. cheaper and way better suspension. they come with a rack but it can be enlarged, but has a full clutch, so no semi auto. but way, way more comfortable than the trail by a long shot. Just a thought. Yes, i own one so speak from direct experience.

I did consider the xr150 but the deal breaker is clutch and swinging leg over seat 100 times a day. Having a free hand to accept tap or decline delivery’s while riding is a must and only doable with an auto or semi auto. Step through and flat board designs are so much easier getting on and off all day when doing delivery. Even if the tap accept wasn’t an issue I don’t want to clutch 8 hours a day. I’ve done that and can really feel it in my hand. Want to avoid arthritis and all that stuff. I’m also curious about trail 125 suspension mods. Like longer suspension that’s softer. Most likely not a thing. Usually suspension mods available for small machines end up being stiffer or same length just adjustable. Can’t be to bad though. Had a few Honda while living in Vietnam. My wave 110 was better in Vietnam bumpy roads then my sym scooter. And it had way less travel then a trail 125.

 

[Little_Thumper_Boy]

look at an XR150L. cheaper and way better suspension. they come with a rack but it can be enlarged, but has a full clutch, so no semi auto. but way, way more comfortable than the trail by a long shot. Just a thought. Yes, i own one so speak from direct experience.

Good idea. Just another thought…there are TW200s out there with dual racks that can pack cargo like the Grizwold Family Truckster. 31” seat height (even lower than the Trail 125), super cush ride, ‘baby sister’ easy pull clutch, ~80mpg. Think I heard someone managed to fit a Rekluse?

 

[m in sc]

ok, i get it.

xr100 front springs and i have adjustable shocks on mine from treatland, so that is an option.

 

[Dallasdude]

Good idea. Just another thought…there are TW200s out there with dual racks that can pack cargo like the Grizwold Family Truckster. 31” seat height (even lower than the Trail 125), super cush ride, ‘baby sister’ easy pull clutch, ~80mpg. Think I heard someone managed to fit a Rekluse?

The tws look nice. I always wanted one just for fun. Just to ride on trails or in Hawaii one day. Dallas is so far from any trails so just a lot of stop and go here. Wouldn’t want to deliver on one. Would really like to ride one about 2 hours in the mountains somewhere. I’ll probably get one one day if I move back to big island Hawaii.

 

[SneakyDingo]

TW200s

They don't like being with a very open throttle for longer periods of time though. I've heard of at least 4 of these with either oil seals or engines blowing up prematurely over the years (less than 11k miles on the odometer). The most recent was earlier this year, Bo switching from the CT125 to a TW200 for the CDT ride, then blowing the oil seals on the way to the start line necessitating yet another bike swap when the CT125 would have been fine. Also has shorter service intervals (3k instead of 4k).

Owning one feels like dating on Tinder to me. Fun for a little while but not a long term investment for me, probably involves burning something - either oil, time or money.