New bike, almost no oil

[TrailSnot]

Thanks for the responses. Good advice all around.

To confirm, I checked the oil with the bike on the centrestand on level ground with the front wheel on the ground. First in my garage and then in the sunshine to be absolutely sure that there was no oil on the dipstick. I am kicking myself for running the bike for about five minutes and then checking the oil as per the manual. This is added wear with so little oil.

I will let the dealer drain the oil from the bike but I will be there when they do it. That way I can see if there is any metal in the oil. It is best that the dealer change the oil. I don't want them to think I am screwing them over, or that this is a scam to get a longer warranty. If there is metal, I will want a new motor and transmission.

I will go over the rest of the bike to make sure everything is in spec. I won't adjust anything at this time, but will document any issues.

As an aside, the rear brake works great but the front feels mushy. Is this typical or should I ask them to bleed the front brake?

Curious to know what your shop had to say. Had the chance to deal with them yet?

 

[CanadianCt125]

Keep us posted. I would take it to the dealership, drain the oil there. And see how much comes out. If it's really not enough there, show them the manual and show what it says. They took on responsibility to prep the bike. At least you can get that money back. If it has no oil or really low, I would try money back.

 

[backfill]

Curious to know what your shop had to say. Had the chance to deal with them yet?

Things went very smoothly with the dealership today. I called first thing this morning and they sent a truck to pick up the bike. I drove directly to the dealership and was there when they rolled the bike into the shop. The mechanic was a straight shooter, no bull kind of guy. I told him that I had bought a new bike in perfect condition, but this was not it any more. He understood that, but said that these small honda bikes motors can take a beating.

He warmed up the bike as per the manual and then checked the oil level. It did not register on the dipstick. He didn't want to drain the oil because it was "break-in" oil. I told him i didn't think there was such a thing any more, but he said that Honda uses it in all of their small bikes.

He drained out some of the oil in a clear cup and checked it in the sunlight for particles. Neither of us saw anything in the oil. He then topped up the engine while i watched. To my surprise, it only took about 200 ml to bring it to the full level on the dipstick. I guess it is way the transmission is shaped. Anyway, the engine was about 25% low on oil, which was much less than I thought it would be. I talked to my brother who is a car mechanic, and he wasn't too concerned about it being 25% low. As he put it, if your car takes 4 litres of oil and it was low 1 litre (25%), you would probably just top it up and move on. That seemed reasonable to me.

I also asked the mechanic about the squishy front brake. He said that sometimes they take a bit to wear in properly, but also suggested pulling the lever as hard as i could towards the throttle grip and zip tying it in that position and leave it over night. I have never heard of doing this before, but he said he doesn't know how or why it works, but it does. I will try it and see.

The dealer mechanic started the bike and let it run for a bit. No clatter or worriesome noises. I asked what would he do if it was his bike and without thinking about it he said he would top up the oil and just ride it. He also thought that if there was going to be a problem it would show up fairly soon, before the first oil change.

I asked for and received a year of extended warranty for peace of mind.

I was very stressed going into this, but the mechanic took lots of time explaining things to me and convinced me that there aren't going to be any major problems. After talking things over with my brother (it is nice to be related to a mechanic) I think all is well in the world. The dealership is bringing my bike back to me tomorrow morning. They would have done it today, but it is spring and they ran out of time.

I believe that the true test of a dealership or any company is how they deal with things when they go wrong. These guys took care of me and my bike, so I am happy with the outcome.

Phil

 

[dmonkey]

Glad you're happy with the outcome.

Zip tying the brake lever creates a constant hydraulic pressure in the brake system that can help move trapped air bubbles back up to the reservoir. It's a lazy way to try to address the issue without bleeding the brake.

 

[AZ7000']

Nice job by them for a $5k bike.... Their money in in $20-$40k side by sides and service/accessories. Like a car dealership these days without the liability!

 

[George]

Just to let you know, I checked out my 2023 new 125 after reading your post and the oil is also low.
I think this might be a common phenomenon.
Canada location

 

[TrailSnot]

Things went very smoothly with the dealership today. I called first thing this morning and they sent a truck to pick up the bike. I drove directly to the dealership and was there when they rolled the bike into the shop. The mechanic was a straight shooter, no bull kind of guy. I told him that I had bought a new bike in perfect condition, but this was not it any more. He understood that, but said that these small honda bikes motors can take a beating.

He warmed up the bike as per the manual and then checked the oil level. It did not register on the dipstick. He didn't want to drain the oil because it was "break-in" oil. I told him i didn't think there was such a thing any more, but he said that Honda uses it in all of their small bikes.

He drained out some of the oil in a clear cup and checked it in the sunlight for particles. Neither of us saw anything in the oil. He then topped up the engine while i watched. To my surprise, it only took about 200 ml to bring it to the full level on the dipstick. I guess it is way the transmission is shaped. Anyway, the engine was about 25% low on oil, which was much less than I thought it would be. I talked to my brother who is a car mechanic, and he wasn't too concerned about it being 25% low. As he put it, if your car takes 4 litres of oil and it was low 1 litre (25%), you would probably just top it up and move on. That seemed reasonable to me.

I also asked the mechanic about the squishy front brake. He said that sometimes they take a bit to wear in properly, but also suggested pulling the lever as hard as i could towards the throttle grip and zip tying it in that position and leave it over night. I have never heard of doing this before, but he said he doesn't know how or why it works, but it does. I will try it and see.

The dealer mechanic started the bike and let it run for a bit. No clatter or worriesome noises. I asked what would he do if it was his bike and without thinking about it he said he would top up the oil and just ride it. He also thought that if there was going to be a problem it would show up fairly soon, before the first oil change.

I asked for and received a year of extended warranty for peace of mind.

I was very stressed going into this, but the mechanic took lots of time explaining things to me and convinced me that there aren't going to be any major problems. After talking things over with my brother (it is nice to be related to a mechanic) I think all is well in the world. The dealership is bringing my bike back to me tomorrow morning. They would have done it today, but it is spring and they ran out of time.

I believe that the true test of a dealership or any company is how they deal with things when they go wrong. These guys took care of me and my bike, so I am happy with the outcome.

Phil

Glad things worked out to your satisfaction. Certainly some decent reasoning from them and your brother about the level of oil and how one would handle it if it were a car. I talked myself through it in the same way with my bike being short. My dealer is yet to contact me.

Your mechanic ought to know why zip tying the front lever can help to remove air bubbles from the fluid though.

 

[ssaigol]

Just to let you know, I checked out my 2023 new 125 after reading your post and the oil is also low.
I think this might be a common phenomenon.
Canada location

Same here with Canadian model. Oil was at lower mark after 55kms. Topped it up with 250 ml.

Called the dealer and alerted them to check oil on new bikes.

 

[cyb3rbyte]

I'll add in my recent discussion in a different thread for archival purposes:

"My oil was low, so I don't know if dealers just aren't checking / going over everything or what. Adding some GN4. No issues running or odd noises.

I think the larger issue people are upset with is that the dealers are CHARGING for this setup of filling oil, checking bolts, attaching battery and mirrors, etc. If they weren't then maybe so many people wouldn't be beaten up about oil being a bit low. I know I'm going to be contacting my dealer and informing them of this, and asking if I can get some money off the setup fee or if I can have some other free service voucher (for parts or first service).

I mean the other thing to consider is these are Hondas. They can and will survive basically anything.

Am I jazzed about a brand new bike I just purchased having less than the minimum amount of oil by 10oz? No, but at least it had SOME oil so as not to catastrophically seize. It never once complained about low oil or made any weird noises. I think the best we can do is to put a PSA on the forum about it so that people know their 2023 may not be entirely full with oil and to check upon pickup or slightly thereafter."

 

[Low_Gravy]

I got a 2023 model about a week ago and just checked the oil last night. Mine was low as well. The dipstick came up dry when I put it in without threading it as the manual says. I then tried threading it in just to see and the oil came up to just above the low level line so it's not low enough that i am worried the engine's health. It's interesting that this seems to be common. This is my first bike, is it standard/common procedure on hondas or other motorcycles to thread the dipstick in and the dealerships are just following the standard instead of the manual? These dealerships probably do hundreds of oil changes on dozens of bikes, if 99% of the manuals say to do it one way, I would likely stop checking the procedure too.

 

[BaldRider]

My oil level was fine but I also doubt it was checked in PDI. I thought I was going to break it trying to unscrew the dipstick.

 

[NMCoyote]

It was your duty as the operator in the seat to check the oil level. That said it “should” have been filled correctly by the service technician but the final inspection is on you, the operator, plain and simple

 

[Tex68w]

Definitely seems to be a 2023 MY issue only. Luckily this issue is easily spotted and rectified. Now that it appears to be a common issue, a stickied notice would be nice to see in the forum.

 

[m in sc]

its the duty of the dealerhsip when they hand a set of keys over to have the vehicle serviced and ready to ride. no iffs ands, or butts about it.

 

[ssaigol]

I got a 2023 model about a week ago and just checked the oil last night. Mine was low as well. The dipstick came up dry when I put it in without threading it as the manual says. I then tried threading it in just to see and the oil came up to just above the low level line so it's not low enough that i am worried the engine's health. It's interesting that this seems to be common. This is my first bike, is it standard/common procedure on hondas or other motorcycles to thread the dipstick in and the dealerships are just following the standard instead of the manual? These dealerships probably do hundreds of oil changes on dozens of bikes, if 99% of the manuals say to do it one way, I would likely stop checking the procedure too.

Do Not! Operate this motorcycle if you don't see oil on the dipstick unscrewed. Add oil before starting.

 

[backfill]

its the duty of the dealerhsip when they hand a set of keys over to have the vehicle serviced and ready to ride. no iffs ands, or butts about it.

Agreed.

I am glad to see that people are checking their oil, but I am shocked at the number of us with the same issue.

 

[Low_Gravy]

Do Not! Operate this motorcycle if you don't see oil on the dipstick unscrewed. Add oil before starting.

No worries, only idled it once at the dealership and again for a few minutes before checking the level. Haven't gotten to ride it yet and won't start it again until I get the oil.

Definitely seems to be a 2023 MY issue only. Luckily this issue is easily spotted and rectified. Now that it appears to be a common issue, a stickied notice would be nice to see in the forum.

If that is true, maybe the 2023 model needs more oil with the oil filter being there now and the amount wasn't properly updated in the service manual? As far as I can tell, the owner's manual doesn't mention the oil filter except for as a line item in the maintenance schedule.

 

[dmonkey]

The capacity w/ filter is mentioned in the specifications section:

 

[Tex68w]

The capacity w/ filter is mentioned in the specifications section:
View attachment 6138

So it does require slightly more oil.

 

[NMCoyote]

its the duty of the dealerhsip when they hand a set of keys over to have the vehicle serviced and ready to ride. no iffs ands, or butts about it.

And if they didn’t, it would be their fault, but it’s your bike that got damaged, not theirs. It is the ultimate responsibility of the operator to inspect and remedy any issues, whether they do it themselves or have it done.